Veil Spammers?

[MVT$]

Update: Have spoken to Parodium (bounty manager) and they will be implementing stricter rules within the second month of the Veil bounty, which starts tomorrow. They have agreed to remove members with negative karma from their campaign and actively discourage users posting new threads as part of the forum avertising bounty. This is a good start!

They can just run a limited signature campaign here instead of incentivised posts. It's a more professional way in my opinion. A good example is selecting at least 10 higher rank and active forum members to wear their signature.

https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?board=355.0

Thank you admin for the swift action.

[dentolas]

Well, I am one of those who have joined the forum advertisement campaign on btt (Veil), and I do agree that there has been a flood of spammers that do not contribute to the discussions and make very low quality posts / create threads indiscriminately... and also agree that this has to be contained and censured as people do not seem to care and just abuse...

but, I do like Veil, and it is really one of my favourites, and I can explain why! I was among the first and I've created only 1 thread about the subject, discussing other things like privacy and not only the Veil project. I have replied to several users and explained my reasons/points of view. I've made several posts that were not related to veil and also others that were, but always contributing to the discussion and not spamming...
the problem with this is the same as post farming with signatures... signatures can also turn into spammy campaigns if users are not serious
so, why where my posts deleted?
probably karma was also gone because of this, wish I would know where I was not contributing to the discussion and improvement of the forum... not guilty that they choose not to run a bounty on this forum, I wish they did.

[Jokers]

Well, I am one of those who have joined the forum advertisement campaign on btt (Veil)
...
why where my posts deleted?

Because such bounty inspires spammers to make useless posts, and that makes a bad reputation to the projest itself, because it started such a bounty. And to prevent spamming, it is the right decision to delete all the posts concerning the project from everywhere except the ANN topic of this project. It is a correct reaction to protect our forum and it's community. I think, if the imformation about cancelling of the spamming bounty is correct, the situation will normalize in some time.

[dentolas]

Well, I am one of those who have joined the forum advertisement campaign on btt (Veil)
...
why where my posts deleted?

Because such bounty inspires spammers to make useless posts, and that makes a bad reputation to the projest itself, because it started such a bounty. And to prevent spamming, it is the right decision to delete all the posts concerning the project from everywhere except the ANN topic of this project. It is a correct reaction to protect our forum and it's community. I think, if the imformation about cancelling of the spamming bounty is correct, the situation will normalize in some time.

So, aren't signature campaigns also inspiring spammers to make useless posts in order to meet the weekly quota? (there are countless posts that state almost nothing and are made of one sentence and these are made with sole the purpose of signature bounty )
Also, the way things are being done, it becomes forbidden to discuss Veil on this forum?

Sorry, but although I agree that the spamming was too much and spammy users should be punished, I see no reason to react with such fundamentalism and in such unfair way... I didn't spam! and if my posts were available, it would be possible to prove this.
Spammer should be punished, but this is not it...

Let's be honnest, this is just another type of bounty... it hurts that the project decided to make it only on BTT forum, but it is no reason for this hunt.
You are actively limiting the freedom of speech on the forum as you are cutting blindly ... I confess that I am dissapointed, I had this forum in very high regard and for me it has been a place of discussion away from the chaos of BTT...

[dentolas]

Besides, in my case, I am sure that my posts were only deleted because of my report on BTT... I can't believe that anyone considered my posts spammy because I was giving my oppinion and helping the discussion... in fact I like Veil .... so this works like being forbidden to use my posts for a bounty on another forum... especially when your SPARTANS encourage the fake posts on BTT threads related with projects supported on ALTS

[Parodium]

I am the bounty manager from Bitcointalk.

The intention of the Veil bounty is to produce quality advertising, and we have clearly stated in the bounty rules that any advertising must be subtle, since we do not promote spam.

Unfortunately, due to time limitations, we are unable to check the exact context of every post made on this forum, so some spammers inevitably end up being rewarded.

If you would like to send me a list of the worst offenders, I will remove them from the bounty and retract their rewards. We do not condone spam.

[dragononcrypto]

Well, I am one of those who have joined the forum advertisement campaign on btt (Veil), and I do agree that there has been a flood of spammers that do not contribute to the discussions and make very low quality posts / create threads indiscriminately... and also agree that this has to be contained and censured as people do not seem to care and just abuse...

but, I do like Veil, and it is really one of my favourites, and I can explain why! I was among the first and I've created only 1 thread about the subject, discussing other things like privacy and not only the Veil project. I have replied to several users and explained my reasons/points of view. I've made several posts that were not related to veil and also others that were, but always contributing to the discussion and not spamming...
the problem with this is the same as post farming with signatures... signatures can also turn into spammy campaigns if users are not serious
so, why where my posts deleted?
probably karma was also gone because of this, wish I would know where I was not contributing to the discussion and improvement of the forum... not guilty that they choose not to run a bounty on this forum, I wish they did.

Your post was moved to Incentivsed Posting for being an incentivised post to promote Veil. If you want to talk about Veil because it's your favorite crypto etc etc that's fine, just don't claim stakes for "posts promoting veil" while doing so, otherwise it's advertising. It becomes spam when it's not a genuine reply to a discussion, but rather a paid response to the discussion in order to directly promote a project.  In my opinion it's not fair to punish newbies for advertising  this project but allow higher ranking members to get away with it, just because they can do it slightly better. As I said feel free to discuss Veil as much as you like, when it's not for paid advertising purposes.

I am the bounty manager from Bitcointalk.

The intention of the Veil bounty is to produce quality advertising, and we have clearly stated in the bounty rules that any advertising must be subtle, since we do not promote spam.

Unfortunately, due to time limitations, we are unable to check the exact context of every post made on this forum, so some spammers inevitably end up being rewarded.

If you would like to send me a list of the worst offenders, I will remove them from the bounty and retract their rewards. We do not condone spam.

Here's a list, it's basically most of them: https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?topic=112178.0

... in fact I like Veil ....

[dentolas]

Sorry man, you can ban me all you like or delete this post, but you are being unfair and hipocrite
you own Jr. Spartans have a task that is "bitcointalk posts bump"
https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?topic=7848.0
this forum pays people to make fake posts and is condemning someone because makes genuine contributions and is paid for it...
check out those threads on btt and see if they are not spammy
Besides, on this forum you award points for posts that can later be converted into coins
so... please be honnest with this...
I insist that this bounty is not much different from sig bounties

And concerning the "not fair to punish newbies for advertising  this project but allow higher ranking members to get away with it", no one mentioned ranking... just should punish the ones spamming... because spamming  is not the same as being paid for speaking about something... (otherwise I bet that a lot of articles wouldn't exist)

[dentolas]

besides, I'm on this forum for some time and I've always contributed without any spamming, trying to help and enrich the forum... I've even posted news on the portuguese section for a while... and as you can see I am also a translator...
If you don't like a campaign and choose to alienate people that contribute for the forum just because they are participating on the campaign... without even caring if these were spamming or not (so without caring if you are being fair or not), this forum will end up on an oligarchy... maybe that's why the royalty status and such...

[dentolas]

Aren't people wearing signatures also under the "incentivised posting"?

[dentolas]

this is not about bounties or stakes, this is about posts being deleted and accusation of spamming without any possibility of discussion... you are deleting everything in spite of being spam or not, just because it belongs to a campaign outside this forum... it became forbidden to speak about Veil as it doesn't have a bounty here...

sorry, but you are being unfair and hipocrite
you own Jr. Spartans have a task that is "bitcointalk posts bump"
https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?topic=7848.0
this forum pays people to make fake posts and is condemning someone because makes genuine contributions and is paid for it...
check out those threads on btt and see if they are not spammy
Besides, on this forum you award points for posts that can later be converted into coins
so... please be honnest with this...

 I'm on this forum for some time and I've always contributed without any spamming, trying to help and enrich the forum... I've even posted news on the portuguese section for a while... and as you can see I am also a translator...
If you don't like a campaign and choose to alienate people that contribute for the forum just because they are participating on the campaign... without even caring if these were spamming or not (so without caring if you are being fair or not), this forum will end up on an oligarchy... maybe that's why the royalty status and such...

not defending spam at all, it is the same with signature campaigns... some people are abusers and spam in order to get the post count, other do not... and if this forum aims to be different and grow, the first thing will be fairness

[Zed0X]

this is not about bounties or stakes, this is about posts being deleted and accusation of spamming without any possibility of discussion... you are deleting everything in spite of being spam or not, just because it belongs to a campaign outside this forum... it became forbidden to speak about Veil as it doesn't have a bounty here...

I don't remember but I think I first found out about Veil thru one of your posts. I did not see it as a spam post but educational. I also don't like what others have done especially the numerous new accounts who only came here to post about the project. However, this is no longer an issue about spamming I think. I don't think we are forbidden, as @dragon said in another thread, everyone is free to talk about it as long as it's not incentivised. Admin already made a stand about this matter. The decision might be tough but it is how it is.     

[Zed0X]

@admin, can we get more clarity on this?
I'm not sure mods have the same interpretation on this.

https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?board=355.0
here's a section to send all those that create many posts due to bounty etc,

Is one post/comment per week due to bounty still accepted?

[dragononcrypto]

Sorry man, you can ban me all you like or delete this post, but you are being unfair and hipocrite
you own Jr. Spartans have a task that is "bitcointalk posts bump"
https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?topic=7848.0
this forum pays people to make fake posts and is condemning someone because makes genuine contributions and is paid for it...
check out those threads on btt and see if they are not spammy
Besides, on this forum you award points for posts that can later be converted into coins
so... please be honnest with this...
I insist that this bounty is not much different from sig bounties

And concerning the "not fair to punish newbies for advertising  this project but allow higher ranking members to get away with it", no one mentioned ranking... just should punish the ones spamming... because spamming  is not the same as being paid for speaking about something... (otherwise I bet that a lot of articles wouldn't exist)

Look I'm sorry if I've pissed you off, this was never my intention. Believe it or not, I do value you and others contributions to the forum, I wouldn't be doing this for nothing if it weren't for the community that exists here.

No one is banning you or deleting your posts, please don't exaggerate. Your post was simply move to Incentivised Posting (where it belongs in my opinion). Yes Jr Spartans had a task a long time ago bumping ANN threads, but no it didn't involve "posts related to altcoinstalks", simply because it's an awful marketing strategy. You're more than welcome to bump the Veil ANN (even for stakes), which isn't even on the first page anymore(??), continue discussing Veil in multiple threads in Cryptocurrency Mining section, local boards, everywhere else etc. Unfortunately altcoins discussion board is a magnet for Veil spam in all and any threads it seems, so I move it.

Please don't try and compare this to signature campaigns, or the forum model as a whole, it's unrelated. Yes there is LOTS of spam from participants, but there is also lots of participants who are able to not spam. Bounties that requires "posts related to X" will always be spammy because "X" is is always advertised. It wasn't so long ago I was promoting DeepOnion and getting negative karma myself, for the same reason. This is why I recognize the damage it does in the long-term.

[dragononcrypto]

this is not about bounties or stakes, this is about posts being deleted and accusation of spamming without any possibility of discussion... you are deleting everything in spite of being spam or not, just because it belongs to a campaign outside this forum... it became forbidden to speak about Veil as it doesn't have a bounty here...

I already made this clear, it is about getting stakes for explicit advertising. I'll say it again: you are free to talk about Veil as much as you like, as long as it's not an incentivised post to advertise the project. If you really care about the project, this wouldn't be a problem for you.

sorry, but you are being unfair and hipocrite
you own Jr. Spartans have a task that is "bitcointalk posts bump"
https://www.altcoinstalks.com/index.php?topic=7848.0
this forum pays people to make fake posts and is condemning someone because makes genuine contributions and is paid for it...
check out those threads on btt and see if they are not spammy
Besides, on this forum you award points for posts that can later be converted into coins
so... please be honnest with this...

I already answered this, you're starting to spam your same point in other threads, which is ironic to say the least:

Yes Jr Spartans had a task a long time ago bumping ANN threads, but no it didn't involve "posts related to altcoinstalks", simply because it's an awful marketing strategy.

[...] However, this is no longer an issue about spamming I think. I don't think we are forbidden, as @dragon said in another thread, everyone is free to talk about it as long as it's not incentivised. [...]

It's true, this isn't just about spamming, it's about incentivised posts and what it incentivises. Nobody cares about the odd posts, but when dozens of users are posting everyday about the same project in every topic they can, it becomes extremely disruptive to the forum, like nothing I have ever seen here before. This is also about Veil bounty treating this forum like trash to advertise in.

It's not just here it's been a problem, I know bitcointalk have their issues with this bounty spam and I imagine other forums are struggling to cope with the spam also. It's literally exhausting moving all of it to IP forum at the moment. I already contacted the bounty manager about the worst spammers and was told they would be removed, instead they were given stakes and told to improve, and are still gaining stakes to this day.

If Veil cared about this forum, and were engaged with the community here, they would have a respectful signature campaign for our members to benefit from (like they do for bct members). All they need to do is allow act sigs as part of their bounty, or act sigs as part of forum advertising (without the spam). Instead they don't offer our members a bounty campaign, they instead subject us to their forum advertising. Yes, I mean subject.