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Cryptocurrency Ecosystem => Crypto Wallets => Topic started by: NikeFit_7777 on August 11, 2024, 12:31:20 PM

Title: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: NikeFit_7777 on August 11, 2024, 12:31:20 PM
Hardware wallet maker Ledger unveiled its new Ledger Flex device at the Bitcoin 2024 conference in Nashville.

The company says it took into account all feedback about the difficulty of using previous models and introduced an intuitive touchscreen device. It is a continuation of the Stax lineup.

(https://i.ibb.co/zsxvN6K/image.png)
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: PX-Z on August 11, 2024, 01:35:37 PM
Nothing much new about the looks of the device, it's just the price getting higher and expensive.

Their slogan is "The world’s first ever secure touchscreen" so they admit that their past touchscreen device is not secured, the Blue and Stax, idk if there are still others lol.

And again, with all so many hardware wallet products, using one or two is enough, having more is just for collectibles purposes.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Zed0X on August 11, 2024, 03:57:03 PM
A result of commercialization eh? This is like seeing how phones releases new model each year with features that aren't really necessary. Anyway, this doesn't come as a surprise anymore since most products related to crypto are targeting mainstream users. I guess good job to them for another source of money?
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: PX-Z on August 12, 2024, 01:32:06 AM
This is like seeing how phones releases new model each year with features that aren't really necessary... I guess good job to them for another source of money?
Sounds like a yes, expect this new release will have limited software updates for at least 2 years just like Apple usually did. A device that only good for few years or maybe least since this is just a smaller device.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: TryNinja on August 12, 2024, 01:36:36 AM
Looks slick, but when talking about managing crypto fortunes, the Ledger X probably has everything one needs. Cable or bluetooth connection and it has a screen big enough for me to see who I'm sending my coins to. Connect, view the transaction, confirm on the device. That's it, that's all I need.

At this point they are out of revolutionary ideas.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: ABCbits on August 12, 2024, 01:29:21 PM
Their slogan is "The world’s first ever secure touchscreen" so they admit that their past touchscreen device is not secured, the Blue and Stax, idk if there are still others lol.

Good point. They might as well as stop producing and remove Stax from their website, just like what they did with Blue.

A result of commercialization eh? This is like seeing how phones releases new model each year with features that aren't really necessary.

I would compare with iPhone and iPhone mini. After all, Flex is cheaper with smaller screen compared with Stax.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Charles-Tim on August 12, 2024, 10:21:29 PM
Hardware wallet maker Ledger unveiled its new Ledger Flex device at the Bitcoin 2024 conference in Nashville.
It will not be a surprise if the wallet is having close source secure electrum and also able to let users send their seed phrase to their parties which is online. A seed phrase that should not leave the device. Also it will not be a surprise if the wallet will evade their users privacy as usual. If I have to use a wallet, I can never use Ledger Nano. If it is the only wallet that is existing, I will never use a hardware wallet.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: joniboini on August 14, 2024, 11:07:48 AM
Makes me wonder how much profit do they actually make from selling stuff like this. Is their reputation really worth the cost to focus on mainstream devices instead of focusing on key consumer like HW enthusiast, who will likely continue to buy/research about HW instead?

Then again this is nothing new. So many companies produces terrible products, especially after they went public. Not sure what's the reason for Ledger though.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Zaguru12 on August 14, 2024, 12:02:54 PM
Makes me wonder how much profit do they actually make from selling stuff like this. Is their reputation really worth the cost to focus on mainstream devices instead of focusing on key consumer like HW enthusiast, who will likely continue to buy/research about HW instead?

Then again this is nothing new. So many companies produces terrible products, especially after they went public. Not sure what's the reason for Ledger though.

I had read one time about them having low sell on their old products and even laying off some workers, but yeah they though going for a new revolutionary product like their fancy one will help keep them in the market, it’s laughable how most of these companies think, but the thing is they will still have people who will go after this product just for convenience sake without caring too much about their privacy, that’s how degenerated this space as turned out to be
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: ABCbits on August 14, 2024, 01:13:39 PM
Makes me wonder how much profit do they actually make from selling stuff like this. Is their reputation really worth the cost to focus on mainstream devices instead of focusing on key consumer like HW enthusiast, who will likely continue to buy/research about HW instead?

But even before they announce Ledger Recover, HW or security enthusiast already aware of other interesting option such as Trezor, ColdCard and Foundation Passport.

Then again this is nothing new. So many companies produces terrible products, especially after they went public. Not sure what's the reason for Ledger though.

Yes, it's somewhat common occurrence when investor or stock holder on public company focused so much on short-term profit. Ledger Recover which have price $9.99/month probably follow what other company does.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Husires on August 14, 2024, 04:14:22 PM
The product offers Seed phrase recovery which means Ledger may be able to access your private key without your permission. The device comes with a secure element chip but the surface is made of Aluminum frame and the price is exaggerated compared to the features.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: dkbit98 on August 16, 2024, 12:25:14 AM
Another closed source flex junk coming from ledger and they didn't even deliver most of the pre-ordered ledger stax devices  ::)
This company is looking more and more like a ponzi scheme to me and they will run out of money sooner or later.
I wouldn't waste my money on flex or any other ledger devices.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Aanuoluwatofunmi on August 16, 2024, 06:21:16 PM
I wonder why they are introducing new developments when the one that should have been tackled by them was left unattended to, when they are gradually loosing their users, yet they are improvising on new technology application, this is about users privacy in which is no more secured with them, i think they have to reconsider this before introducing any offer or development to the community.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Lucius on August 17, 2024, 04:10:50 PM
I will not comment at all on the appearance or functionality of the new device, because honestly I would not take it even if they gave it for free. After the scandal with the leakage of a huge amount of personal data of users (which their CEO calls trivial) and the idea to enable the extraction of seeds in order to recover with the help of third parties, I don't know who would think of buying their product.

Fortunately for them, there are too many people who are not really even aware of the risks that come from using their devices.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Rikafip on August 17, 2024, 10:17:03 PM
After the scandal with the leakage of a huge amount of personal data of users (which their CEO calls trivial) and the idea to enable the extraction of seeds in order to recover with the help of third parties, I don't know who would think of buying their product.
There are still loads of new people coming into crypto every day who have no idea about the issues with Ledger. However, somehow they've heard about it, and there are even those who know all about it but still trust them. So, I'm pretty sure Ledger is doing just fine.

That reminds me of a situation on another forum (a general forum with a crypto subforum) where I was unsuccessfully trying to explain to people all the ways Ledger had lied to their users. They just didn't want to listen, in their minds Ledger was the best and most secure wallet.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Lucius on August 18, 2024, 02:45:26 PM
@Rikafip, when it comes to new users who are not inclined to research what they are buying, it is not so difficult to understand why they choose their devices - but the real enigma is those users who were (and still are) exposed to risk not only from online attacks, but also with regard to public publication of addresses and phone numbers and possible physical attacks.

To me, this is just proof that the average user of any hardware wallet does not understand how important it is that other people do not know that he has it, and that the same device cannot in any way communicate with a remote server and share confidential information.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: _act_ on August 20, 2024, 12:15:53 PM
Another closed source flex junk coming from ledger and they didn't even deliver most of the pre-ordered ledger stax devices  ::)
When Trezor Safe 3 was not yet out, people were saying it is not possible to have open source secure element because most hardware wallets have close source or semi close source secure elements. Now Trezor made Trezor Safe 3 to have open source secure element. Also the coming Safe 5 will have open source secure element. Ledger Nano has been fooling people since many years ago. Even I remember a time when Bitcointalk users still recommended Ledger wallets until the company grow from worse to worst.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: bitbit97 on August 20, 2024, 12:50:15 PM
So they have introduced the same product/service but in a new packaging. They follow same history mobile phones had, from buttons to tap screen. I can already predict that new device that will come out will have a colorful display. Then the next stage will be make it more thin, but reduce battery life. That would allows them to make their next device "runs x days more".

I like my ledger because it is small, compact, fit everywhere in every pocket and etc. Now I must carry basically "two phones" with me. No, thank you.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Lucius on August 20, 2024, 01:16:13 PM
~snip~
I like my ledger because it is small, compact, fit everywhere in every pocket and etc. Now I must carry basically "two phones" with me. No, thank you.


It's true that Ledger promoted its model X as a "wallet on the go" because it has a bluetooth and can simply be wirelessly connected to a smartphone, but I've never felt that such devices should be carried around because they can attract someone's attention.

Of course, the most popular Ledger models look like a USB stick, so that's a certain advantage for them - but I don't prefer public use of such devices because I feel quite safe with a hot wallet on a smartphone with some amount that isn't too valuable to give me a headache if I "lose" it.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: bitbit97 on August 20, 2024, 03:29:40 PM
~snip~
I like my ledger because it is small, compact, fit everywhere in every pocket and etc. Now I must carry basically "two phones" with me. No, thank you.


It's true that Ledger promoted its model X as a "wallet on the go" because it has a bluetooth and can simply be wirelessly connected to a smartphone, but I've never felt that such devices should be carried around because they can attract someone's attention.

Of course, the most popular Ledger models look like a USB stick, so that's a certain advantage for them - but I don't prefer public use of such devices because I feel quite safe with a hot wallet on a smartphone with some amount that isn't too valuable to give me a headache if I "lose" it.

I carry that "usb stick" all the time in my bag (just in case). That aluminum case protects greatly plastic device. Even if it is on the table, it does not attract any attention. Everyone saw "usb stick" nowadays. With new Ledger Flex it wont be that easy. It looks more like an unusual device and I think if someone would, he would pick it up just to twist in hand and look what it is. The device with one button (even though there are two) would attract less attention than a pocket pc like device. Imho you would be more safe with "usb stick".
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: dkbit98 on August 20, 2024, 10:48:59 PM
When Trezor Safe 3 was not yet out, people were saying it is not possible to have open source secure element because most hardware wallets have close source or semi close source secure elements. Now Trezor made Trezor Safe 3 to have open source secure element. Also the coming Safe 5 will have open source secure element. Ledger Nano has been fooling people since many years ago. Even I remember a time when Bitcointalk users still recommended Ledger wallets until the company grow from worse to worst.
Source code for new trezor devices can be inspected but you can't change or update it.
Real advantage is that Trezor doens't have signed any NDA with manufactuter Infineon, so they can publish any flaws they found in secure element code.
Most if not all other hardware wallets have signed NDA with manufacturers of their secure elements.
Trezor is also working on Tropic Square chip so they will manufacture their own chip in future.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Rikafip on August 21, 2024, 10:09:21 AM
I carry that "usb stick" all the time in my bag (just in case). That aluminum case protects greatly plastic device. Even if it is on the table, it does not attract any attention. Everyone saw "usb stick" nowadays.
Aren't you even a little bit afraid that someone might actually figure out that its not just an ordinary USB stick but instead the hardware wallet? I mean, it does look like just another USB stick, but given its popularity someone might recognzie it and attempt $5 wrench attack.

Chances of that happening are of course slim but they do exist and I personally wouldn't feel safe carrying my hardware wallet around. At least not the main one.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: _act_ on August 21, 2024, 12:02:16 PM
I carry that "usb stick" all the time in my bag (just in case). That aluminum case protects greatly plastic device. Even if it is on the table, it does not attract any attention. Everyone saw "usb stick" nowadays.
Aren't you even a little bit afraid that someone might actually figure out that its not just an ordinary USB stick but instead the hardware wallet? I mean, it does look like just another USB stick, but given its popularity someone might recognzie it and attempt $5 wrench attack.

Chances of that happening are of course slim but they do exist and I personally wouldn't feel safe carrying my hardware wallet around. At least not the main one.
You can encrypt the USB stick or encrypt the seed phrase or private key that you have in it. But I think it is more like a paper wallet and not what you can easily be using for making transaction daily. I prefer to have some coins on my mobile phone which is also protected with my experience in avoiding malware.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: Lucius on August 21, 2024, 02:43:48 PM
~snip~
Chances of that happening are of course slim but they do exist and I personally wouldn't feel safe carrying my hardware wallet around. At least not the main one.


Of course, there are situations when no one should play with the use of hot wallets, for example when someone would physically sell some cryptocurrency in a larger amount - and I personally would not be too comfortable having more than 0.10 BTC (if even that much) in a mobile wallet.

However, most HW today allow us to have several accounts, and the main one should preferably be protected with a passphrase, so that even using such devices in an "insecure environment" does not necessarily have to be dangerous (although it can definitely attract someone's attention).
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: bitbit97 on August 22, 2024, 03:41:58 PM
I carry that "usb stick" all the time in my bag (just in case). That aluminum case protects greatly plastic device. Even if it is on the table, it does not attract any attention. Everyone saw "usb stick" nowadays.
Aren't you even a little bit afraid that someone might actually figure out that its not just an ordinary USB stick but instead the hardware wallet? I mean, it does look like just another USB stick, but given its popularity someone might recognzie it and attempt $5 wrench attack.

Chances of that happening are of course slim but they do exist and I personally wouldn't feel safe carrying my hardware wallet around. At least not the main one.

By looking on people that surround me right now, $5 wrench attack from them gives me a smile. Of course I should be more cautious. But if someone see Ledger Flex and Ledger nano on the table, they will have more question what it is about Flex. Nevertheless, even if someone steals my bag with wallet and ledger, they will be more interested in using my bank cards, than trying to figure out what is this USB stick for and why it has a screen. Even if I face a robber, he will be more interested in cash and watch, maybe will try to use cards for "less than 50 EUR without pin purchase". I have really huge doubts that someone will try to rob me on purpose to get ledger nano and torture me to get a pin code.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: joniboini on August 22, 2024, 04:19:47 PM
I have really huge doubts that someone will try to rob me on purpose to get ledger nano and torture me to get a pin code.
I understand that crypto is niche in some countries, but personally I'd not risk it. Buying a product like this flex device or whatever Ledger will release in the future is inviting more risk with no reason at all. I think think can change quickly. Even in my city where most people are not up to date with crypto, when you mention Bitcoin or something similar there's a higher chance that some of them know little about it compared to a few years ago.
Title: Re: Ledger has introduced the new Ledger Flex device
Post by: bitbit97 on August 23, 2024, 12:26:38 PM
I have really huge doubts that someone will try to rob me on purpose to get ledger nano and torture me to get a pin code.
I understand that crypto is niche in some countries, but personally I'd not risk it. Buying a product like this flex device or whatever Ledger will release in the future is inviting more risk with no reason at all. I think think can change quickly. Even in my city where most people are not up to date with crypto, when you mention Bitcoin or something similar there's a higher chance that some of them know little about it compared to a few years ago.

If there are a lot of people who are no up to date with crypto, then you should not worry much about having any risk with Ledger. I see minimum danger if I live mine near pc at work together with other usb flash stick and go for a lunch. The maximum would my colleagues would do is to take ledger nano, did not figure out how to insert it into USB drive, put back and take other, real, usb. But if they take Ledger Flex, and the screen eventually turns of, they will ask what it is definitely.