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[Fivestar4everMVP]

Both mentioned mixers invested a lot of money in the development and promotion of the platform, certainly, they were considered reliable. Although they did not announce the reasons for exiting the market, we all assume why it happened. I'm pretty sure if there weren't certain 'SEC' events some of them would still be operational.

I don't know why, but whenever I see a mixer service disappear without letting its users know that they are going to stop providing their service, I always think it's an exit scam and they never had good intentions. I never managed to understand how mixers get seized by the Government and what technology they used to seize those mixers and arrest the owners of these platforms. I always felt like most of them are just exit scam and some of them were seized by the authorities.

You are very correct and I have to completely agree with you, after the take over and closing down of chipmixer which was evident and verifiable to the general public, some mixer developers and management have seen this as one of the easiest means of exit the market quietly without making alot of noise.
The chipmixer incident have opened the doors to other mixers to sometimes, even comoflage and make users believe they have been seized by the SEC, making users to simply move on and don't scream scam.

In the case of unjoin and tumbler, my instinct tells me this two mixers in particular performed a scam exit, (except there is any evidence to prove otherwise), including one other mixer that did close down few weeks after the sec seized CM, and even changed their website to make look like the sec really took it over.

Why I said tumbler and Unijoin performed a scam exit is because, if truly they were seized by the sec, same sec would have also come after mixers like mixero, thormixer, coinomize and the rest.

[Lucius]

~snip~
Mixers make money, and they should spend enough money to secure their own privacy first, and then provide privacy to their users. I remember I saw a mixer end their service and recommended using XMR before they ended their service. I appreciate that they informed people that they are going to end their service.

We cannot expect that all mixers are owned by serious people who know how to properly protect themselves, but there are also those mixers that are started by individuals who are not up to the task. All those who aim to suppress this type of service always choose easy targets first, and only then focus on those with serious owners.

In the end, it's just a question of how many resources "they" will invest to take down some mixers - and it's obvious that their main trigger for a total attack on some mixers is the large amount of coins they associate with hacking, especially if that same hacking has something to do with one of countries that are on their black list.

[God Of Thunder]

You are very correct and I have to completely agree with you, after the take over and closing down of chipmixer which was evident and verifiable to the general public, some mixer developers and management have seen this as one of the easiest means of exit the market quietly without making alot of noise.
The chipmixer incident have opened the doors to other mixers to sometimes, even comoflage and make users believe they have been seized by the SEC, making users to simply move on and don't scream scam.

I remember even an exchange rug pulled simultaneously when the chip mixer was seized. They edited the same picture the authorities posted on the chip mixer Website. The exchange name was Bettercallitraul, and it ran a signature campaign on the other forum. They used the picture on their Website to pretend they were seized by the authorities, which was a lie. This proves that many shady services were waiting for these opportunities.

We cannot expect that all mixers are owned by serious people who know how to properly protect themselves, but there are also those mixers that are started by individuals who are not up to the task. All those who aim to suppress this type of service always choose easy targets first, and only then focus on those with serious owners.

This is why people should avoid services that do not spend money on marketing or do not build any reputation on the market. But, in general, we expect mixer service providers to care much more about privacy than the users.

[Lucius]

We cannot expect that all mixers are owned by serious people who know how to properly protect themselves, but there are also those mixers that are started by individuals who are not up to the task. All those who aim to suppress this type of service always choose easy targets first, and only then focus on those with serious owners.

This is why people should avoid services that do not spend money on marketing or do not build any reputation on the market. But, in general, we expect mixer service providers to care much more about privacy than the users.

We can only start from the assumption that everything stated in the terms of use is true, but we have seen from some past cases that this is not always the case. One of the most famous mixers (CM) claims a lot in its conditions, but when they were seized we found out that they weren't really telling the truth - private keys that were supposed to be deleted after 7 days were kept for some reason for months or even years.

The key thing is that both parties should be maximally dedicated to privacy, because that way the risk for both is minimal.

[MrSpasybo]

Very true and I completely agree with you, for except the internet seize to exist, there will always be innovations that possibly doesn't sit well with the government, but will exist as long as there are people interested in such innovations, the worst the government can do is try to such as many down, but then, the more they shut down, the more new ones are coming up..

A good example is when and after chipmixer was seized and shut down, mixers weren't that much before then, infact, I think it probably wont be up to ten mixers that existed then, but immediately after chipmixer was seized and taken down, mixers started popping up like gambling casinos, though not every one of them are legit, but then, mixers have become more popular than they were in the past before the government took chipmixer down.

From a localized perspective, governments have the capacity to suppress a few Mixers. However, on a broader scale, governments cannot eradicate all Mixers due to limited human and time resources. Their efforts are primarily aimed at deterring other Mixers, but unfortunately, this hasn't been effective: Mixers continue to be developed and serve the privacy needs of crypto users.

Governments also seek to penalize specific users to discourage Mixer usage, but this is equally infeasible. ThorMixer does not store user-related data, making it difficult for governments to obtain user information for charges or punishments. Unlike CEXs requiring operational licenses, ThorMixer solely focuses on users and operates for their benefit.

[dkbit98]

Jambler can surely give more reputation and safety to any new mixers that partners with them.
As alternative to adding anything on Jambler website I would suggestion adding a small partnership note in this Thromixer topic OP.
Most of us already knows that, but this would be useful for any newbies who are using Thormixer for the first time. 

[SamReomo]

Jambler can surely give more reputation and safety to any new mixers that partners with them.
As alternative to adding anything on Jambler website I would suggestion adding a small partnership note in this Thromixer topic OP.
Most of us already knows that, but this would be useful for any newbies who are using Thormixer for the first time.

That's a good suggestion but I don't think that Thormixer needs extra reputation as it has already got its reputation by being reliable and workable even in the times when other mixers or privacy centered services simply quit providing their services to customers. However, there's nothing wrong if some partnership note is added because that won't impact Thormixer or Jambler's reputation as both of those are reputed platforms.

[God Of Thunder]

We can only start from the assumption that everything stated in the terms of use is true, but we have seen from some past cases that this is not always the case. One of the most famous mixers (CM) claims a lot in its conditions, but when they were seized we found out that they weren't really telling the truth - private keys that were supposed to be deleted after 7 days were kept for some reason for months or even years.

Yeah. I remember the authorities seized 7TB of Data and 46 million worth of BTC at that time. Can you imagine how much data they have stored? A couple of forum members have disappeared since then, and one of them is their campaign manager. They were promising to provide the best privacy, which I guess they did. But they stored all the user's data, and some of those users fear that case till now. I don't think CM had any benefit from storing these data. But they just lied to the users and now the users are in possible danger. But when it comes to Thormixer, I guess they had to follow What Jambler provides/suggests. If it's software from Jambler and not just API's. Then Jambler has the main responsibility.

[Lucius]

Yeah. I remember the authorities seized 7TB of Data and 46 million worth of BTC at that time. Can you imagine how much data they have stored?

I think the conclusion is that it is not about 7 TB of data, but that it is probably about the total disk space - although it remains unclear to this day what the authorities managed to seize. However, we can assume that they saved absolutely everything they could save.

A couple of forum members have disappeared since then, and one of them is their campaign manager. They were promising to provide the best privacy, which I guess they did. But they stored all the user's data, and some of those users fear that case till now.

He didn't completely disappear, he was still active with his lending service after all - although it seems to me that he hasn't been online at all lately. I would say that everything they did over the years was completely pointless if they messed up so badly in the end.

I don't think CM had any benefit from storing these data. But they just lied to the users and now the users are in possible danger. But when it comes to Thormixer, I guess they had to follow What Jambler provides/suggests. If it's software from Jambler and not just API's. Then Jambler has the main responsibility.

Data can be good insurance if you find yourself in trouble - because when it comes to punishment and a possible settlement, it's always important what you can offer those who accuse you of something. It seems to me that the owner just wanted to have something with which he could help himself in case he was caught one day.

[MrSpasybo]

Yeah. I remember the authorities seized 7TB of Data and 46 million worth of BTC at that time. Can you imagine how much data they have stored? A couple of forum members have disappeared since then, and one of them is their campaign manager. They were promising to provide the best privacy, which I guess they did. But they stored all the user's data, and some of those users fear that case till now. I don't think CM had any benefit from storing these data. But they just lied to the users and now the users are in possible danger. But when it comes to Thormixer, I guess they had to follow What Jambler provides/suggests. If it's software from Jambler and not just API's. Then Jambler has the main responsibility.

I'm unaware of this event, possibly because I wasn't paying attention nor using Mixers around the time it occurred. Additionally, crypto media wasn't as developed or widespread back then. I hope that current Mixers like ThorMixer have learned from that event and made changes to ensure user safety in all scenarios, even if the Mixers face legal issues.

ThorMixer has been operating for a long time, and I believe it's one of the most successful Mixers: it has a community, users, and a reason to protect its revenue by providing the best service to users. At the very least, it doesn't store any user information to protect their anonymity.

[TryNinja]

Yeah. I remember the authorities seized 7TB of Data and 46 million worth of BTC at that time. Can you imagine how much data they have stored?

To be fair we don't know what they were storing. Like, I can't see their user logs (deposits and withdrawn chips) taking that much space (7 TB??). Maybe they actually were on a different business at the same time which required a lot more data?

[Fivestar4everMVP]

Jambler can surely give more reputation and safety to any new mixers that partners with them.
As alternative to adding anything on Jambler website I would suggestion adding a small partnership note in this Thromixer topic OP.
Most of us already knows that, but this would be useful for any newbies who are using Thormixer for the first time.

That's a good suggestion but I don't think that Thormixer needs extra reputation as it has already got its reputation by being reliable and workable even in the times when other mixers or privacy centered services simply quit providing their services to customers. However, there's nothing wrong if some partnership note is added because that won't impact Thormixer or Jambler's reputation as both of those are reputed platforms.

Well, for me, I really do not think Thormixer needs any jambler stuff on whatever is related to them (Thormixer) and their services, specially when and if it's certain that Thormixer wanted to act as a stand alone mixer, so far so good, Thormixer have managed to build a good reputation for themselves and whether they decide now to add whatever is jambler related to their information, that won't change a thing.

And on the other hand, I don't know if it's just me, but I honestly do not find jambler to be that influencial in the bitcoin mixing business, I think even chipmixer was way more popular and influencial when they still were in operation.

[dkbit98]

That's a good suggestion but I don't think that Thormixer needs extra reputation as it has already got its reputation by being reliable and workable even in the times when other mixers or privacy centered services simply quit providing their services to customers.

I never said they need anything extra, but Thormixer literraly started with their service in 2023.

To be fair we don't know what they were storing. Like, I can't see their user logs (deposits and withdrawn chips) taking that much space (7 TB??). Maybe they actually were on a different business at the same time which required a lot more data?

Just operating a website like they did needs a lot of space, and it's not like they stored personal information of their customers.
Worst case scenario they would find data for bitcoin full nodes and connection between BTC addresses.
It's interesting that alleged CM owner was never actually arrested and authorities didn't publish any of that data, so we have to trust their word.

[bitmover]

Yeah. I remember the authorities seized 7TB of Data and 46 million worth of BTC at that time. Can you imagine how much data they have stored? A couple of forum members have disappeared since then, and one of them is their campaign manager. They were promising to provide the best privacy, which I guess they did. But they stored all the user's data, and some of those users fear that case till now. I don't think CM had any benefit from storing these data. But they just lied to the users and now the users are in possible danger. But when it comes to Thormixer, I guess they had to follow What Jambler provides/suggests. If it's software from Jambler and not just API's. Then Jambler has the main responsibility.

I'm unaware of this event, possibly because I wasn't paying attention nor using Mixers around the time it occurred. Additionally, crypto media wasn't as developed or widespread back then. I hope that current Mixers like ThorMixer have learned from that event and made changes to ensure user safety in all scenarios, even if the Mixers face legal issues.

This was just 2 years ago. One year after that event mixers were banned from BTT and we all came here.

Mixers never had high media coverage, but there were many reports about this case in the past in different crypto media. You can just about Chipmixer being seized that you will find a lot of information about.

A couple of forum members have disappeared since then, and one of them is their campaign manager. They were promising to provide the best privacy, which I guess they did. But they stored all the user's data, and some of those users fear that case till now.

He didn't completely disappear, he was still active with his lending service after all - although it seems to me that he hasn't been online at all lately. I would say that everything they did over the years was completely pointless if they messed up so badly in the end.

My guess is that all forum members are fine... nobody was doing anything illegal.

I guess most forum members disappeared because they stopped making money with those campaigns. Specially the manager, who made lot of money.

[God Of Thunder]

ThorMixer has been operating for a long time, and I believe it's one of the most successful Mixers: it has a community, users, and a reason to protect its revenue by providing the best service to users. At the very least, it doesn't store any user information to protect their anonymity.

I also want to believe they do not store any data, as they say there are no logs. CM also said the same thing, but they ended up storing all the data, and the authorities seized 7 TB of storage or data. All we can do is trust what they say and use their service. But if we figure out something else, that will be too late for all of us. But forget about that; I really hope Thormixer keeps its promises and never stores any data.

To be fair we don't know what they were storing. Like, I can't see their user logs (deposits and withdrawn chips) taking that much space (7 TB??). Maybe they actually were on a different business at the same time which required a lot more data?

  It's possible. I cannot imagine having 7 TB data which only contains text documents. A single text file with hundreds of transaction details will take only a few KB. So, 7 TB is a lot. Possibly that includes a lot of software and other files.