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Author Topic: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For  (Read 9127 times)

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2024, 07:42:56 AM »
How should we take the reality of the things happening in El Salvador as far as its adoption of Bitcoin  as a national currency? As for me, this is telling us that Bitcoin may be harder to be adopted as a currency just like the usual fiat money we know and it is principally because of its volatility.

Let’s even say that bitcoin is not a volatile currency, do you still think it’ll be easier to be adopted by the government? The government will never allow any decentralized digital currency to be used more over theirs because that will kill the value of their own currencies faster. They’re typically against it and will use the volatile nature of it as one of the reasons they’ll not adopt it.

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Can we then say that Bitcoin is good for holding and not for the usual payments like buying groceries or buying a cup of coffee all because we may feel we are letting go of an opportunity that in the next day the value of Bitcoin would go up?

The main purpose may be for the former but the later is more adopted and that has enabled more people to cherish the currency more and adopted it. The mass adoption of it came often from the people that have embraced it for use as an investable asset and not a currency to be used for daily expenses and transactions. The primary purpose of bitcoin is to serve as alternative to fiat currency but today, as it stands as alternative to it, bitcoin enthusiasts have also leverage into using it for investment purposes.

In the end BTC will not be for the people when only governments like EL Salvador or US are going to be mining BTC.  We see Russia and China already plans to mine Bitcoin as well.

The governments are shifting to just mining BTC and it will not be surprising what Trump means when he said he wants to make sure BTC is only mined in the US.

BTC will be adopted but more than likely for the international trades than individuals using it.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2024, 07:42:56 AM »

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2024, 12:07:50 PM »
I think that Bukele and his sponsors made a biggest mistake when they created fully custodial bitcoin Chivo wallet, instead of educating people about importance of non-custodial wallets.
They are also forcing Lightning Network in same Chivo wallet, and that project is total disaster pushed and promoted by several people on top.
If he wants to increase adoption he should accept Bitcoin payments in all stores and government services, but he can't force people to use Bitcoin.

Making people use custodial service is far easier than self-custodial ones, since that way people would have less responsibility regarding backup and security. But otherwise i agree he could've make some government service/store accept Bitcoin.
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2024, 12:07:50 PM »

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2024, 02:20:57 PM »
How should we take the reality of the things happening in El Salvador as far as its adoption of Bitcoin  as a national currency? As for me, this is telling us that Bitcoin may be harder to be adopted as a currency just like the usual fiat money we know and it is principally because of its volatility.

If you ask me, I would say the adoptions depend on how techy the people are. There are huge generation gaps as well. We are still in the early stages of Bitcoin. There are a lot of people who do not understand how Bitcoin works and mostly they do not believe that Bitcoin can be used as money. Mostly they fear losing their money if they keep it in Bitcoin. The day will change at some point and people will continue to adapt Bitcoin as time goes by.

I cannot expect my grand parents to start using bitcoin or my parents to use it because they know nothing about it. They are more familiar with the traditional fiat money system which they will continue to use till their last day of their life. But when it will comes to my kids, I guess most of them will start using Bitcoin when they will grow. We need time.
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2024, 11:19:34 PM »
Making people use custodial service is far easier than self-custodial ones, since that way people would have less responsibility regarding backup and security. But otherwise i agree he could've make some government service/store accept Bitcoin.
Is it really easier to use custodial services, yeah, it eliminates responsibility, but it carries the risk of a third party controlling ones funds. I don't think people in El salvador would struggle to use self custodial wallets with a little guidance, and keeping their seed phrase safe is also something that they can do easily, if they had been exposed to what BTC truly is, i feel adoption may have been better than what it is now.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2024, 11:30:39 PM »
Making people use custodial service is far easier than self-custodial ones, since that way people would have less responsibility regarding backup and security. But otherwise i agree he could've make some government service/store accept Bitcoin.
Sure it's easier to use it but everyone can see and even Bukele admits how this didn't help bitcoin adoption at all, same as lightning network.
I don't know how much time it needs to pass for some people to realize that and accept the reality.
Making something easier doesn't mean it is always going to be good.
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2024, 11:50:03 PM »
I do think that we are going to see the adoption getting bigger and bigger eventually, it shouldn't really be that big of a deal at all, it should be as normal as it gets and we can't really consider this a "failure" just yet. We are going to see this happen very late, because we are talking about adopting it to the whole nation, you may not get something like that easily, it may take a long long time for that to happen. But at the very least they ended up with a good result for now, and they are growing, and they could make a lot more money if bitcoin goes up as well, which would be amazing for them.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2024, 03:30:35 PM »
Sure it's easier to use it but everyone can see and even Bukele admits how this didn't help bitcoin adoption at all, same as lightning network.
I don't know how much time it needs to pass for some people to realize that and accept the reality.
Making something easier doesn't mean it is always going to be good.

To avoid forgetting passwords, we can always write them in front of our desktops. But how many of us are going to do that? Probably none. Why? For obvious reasons. We do not write our password somewhere where everyone can see it. But why do we use custodial services? Just because it's easier? Do we all know the risk of the custodial services? Probably not.

Bitcoin and cryptocurrency are still in their early stages compared to traditional fiat money. Society started to become cashless slowly, but people still love to use fiat because they are familiar with it. They have been introduced to fiat money since they were toddlers. As I said in my previous post, there is a generation gap as well.

Gen-Z is interested in digital money, and I would like to believe at least more than 50% of crypto users are under 45 years old. I cannot expect my grandparents to use Bitcoin even if I live in a most developed country because they don't know the concept and how to use Bitcoin. Nobody informed them about Bitcoin. It will take time and Bitcoin will have more adoption as times goes by.
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2024, 03:30:35 PM »


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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2024, 04:49:54 PM »
El Salvador hasn't adopted Bitcoin as a "national" currency as the OP suggests, but just as a legal tender. The main currency remains to be the US Dollar.
Low adoption of Bitcoin cannot be a surprise to anyone really. I've said thi plenty of times before and I'll say it again, people will not use bitcoins if they don't earn any income in bitcoins. If they earn in fiat, buying bitcoins just to spend them makes little to no sense (unless we're talking about dark market etc), it's just an unnecessary step that comes with extra fees.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #23 on: September 04, 2024, 12:31:51 PM »
Making people use custodial service is far easier than self-custodial ones, since that way people would have less responsibility regarding backup and security. But otherwise i agree he could've make some government service/store accept Bitcoin.
Is it really easier to use custodial services, yeah, it eliminates responsibility, but it carries the risk of a third party controlling ones funds.

I agree. Although it's worth to note the wallet issued by government, who trusted by some of their citizen.

I don't think people in El salvador would struggle to use self custodial wallets with a little guidance, and keeping their seed phrase safe is also something that they can do easily, if they had been exposed to what BTC truly is, i feel adoption may have been better than what it is now.

I agree, although how many people willing to spend some time to learn and get used?
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #24 on: September 04, 2024, 09:10:19 PM »
To get something even bigger, it will take a while for El Salvador to keep seeing a result. The fact that they invested on the last bull run and been waiting for a better return is the main reason. They got all their people into the bear season and that made people doubt it, but he won the reelection which means that he is going to end up with a good result for a while longer, he has time to wait. I bet that if he can get elected again officially, he will get reelected again, dude is liked by his nation and has high votes, so he has the patience to wait some more and maybe that will help him with bitcoin too.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2024, 11:08:14 PM »
I do think that we are going to see the adoption getting bigger and bigger eventually, it shouldn't really be that big of a deal at all, it should be as normal as it gets and we can't really consider this a "failure" just yet. We are going to see this happen very late, because we are talking about adopting it to the whole nation, you may not get something like that easily, it may take a long long time for that to happen. But at the very least they ended up with a good result for now, and they are growing, and they could make a lot more money if bitcoin goes up as well, which would be amazing for them.

I don’t think all of that matters to them now. How much longer do you think it will take to have this mass adoption we are always anticipating for? The use of the word that it happen very late makes me ponder to how much longer it has to take? So many innovations don’t take long like bitcoin has taken before they’re widely accepted by the masses and the government. The only difference bitcoin has with them is that it is decentralised and it will never be able to controlled by the government. It will surely take a long time but how long more will it take is what we don’t all know and keep anticipating for the best from it. 

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2024, 12:29:41 PM »
I do think that we are going to see the adoption getting bigger and bigger eventually, it shouldn't really be that big of a deal at all, it should be as normal as it gets and we can't really consider this a "failure" just yet. We are going to see this happen very late, because we are talking about adopting it to the whole nation, you may not get something like that easily, it may take a long long time for that to happen. But at the very least they ended up with a good result for now, and they are growing, and they could make a lot more money if bitcoin goes up as well, which would be amazing for them.

I don’t think all of that matters to them now. How much longer do you think it will take to have this mass adoption we are always anticipating for? The use of the word that it happen very late makes me ponder to how much longer it has to take? So many innovations don’t take long like bitcoin has taken before they’re widely accepted by the masses and the government. The only difference bitcoin has with them is that it is decentralised and it will never be able to controlled by the government. It will surely take a long time but how long more will it take is what we don’t all know and keep anticipating for the best from it.

Well Bukele government put a bet on it already, and so as long as he is in power, they will definitely and go and look for Bitcoin in their country to be mass adopted. We all know that there are oppositions, but since he is in power and doing a lot of good things I supposed as far as crime rate in the country, he could still be in the power for the next 4-6 years and so their population has nowhere to go but to adopt it. And maybe he will be proud of his decision once we hit Bitcoin at $100k or more next year.

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #27 on: September 16, 2024, 06:47:01 AM »
...
How should we take the reality of the things happening in El Salvador as far as its adoption of Bitcoin  as a national currency? As for me, this is telling us that Bitcoin may be harder to be adopted as a currency just like the usual fiat money we know and it is principally because of its volatility.

Can we then say that Bitcoin is good for holding and not for the usual payments like buying groceries or buying a cup of coffee all because we may feel we are letting go of an opportunity that in the next day the value of Bitcoin would go up?

Since he is a leader who has taken bold steps for Bitcoin and his country, I think he has the right to criticize harshly on some issues. So, even if his approach to this issue is emotional, I think he's right. I don't have the same ideas and expectations as Bukele, but I find his criticism justified because I appreciate his efforts...

When the velocity of circulation of money increases, its value decreases. I don't prefer buying coffee with Bitcoin and don't want this to become widespread. I think Bitcoin should be a store of value rather than a medium of exchange to meet daily needs. We should use the less valuable medium of exchange to buy gum at the grocery store. Using Bitcoin for these kinds of things hurts the value and meaning of Bitcoin...
« Last Edit: September 16, 2024, 07:07:10 AM by trendcoin »
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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #28 on: September 16, 2024, 07:16:01 AM »
Since he is a leader who has taken bold steps for Bitcoin and his country, I think he has the right to criticize harshly on some issues. So, even if his approach to this issue is emotional, I think he's right. I don't have the same ideas and expectations as Bukele, but I find his criticism justified because I appreciate his efforts...
i do not know much about him but how he approaches bitcoin adoption in their country is admirable he acknowledges the challenges pose of bitcoin adoption but still remained hopeful and did what he thinks could be the best for the country

we know the potential of bitcoin but as a leader, he has to stay truthful to his citizens and tell them what is the state of the country
Quote
Using Bitcoin for these kinds of things hurts the value and meaning of Bitcoin...
well a lot of people would argue since bitcoin started as a means of exchange without the need for a centralized authority to make the transaction but now that the value of bitcoin has reached heights no one probably expected it will 10 or 15 years ago, the approach has changed and now bitcoin is almost not used for that anymore

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Re: Bukele: Bitcoin Hasn’t Had the Widespread Adoption We Hoped For
« Reply #29 on: September 16, 2024, 10:16:43 PM »
Maybe Bukele plans with Bitcoin adoption was not like he expected, but his country El Salvador will no longer require external debt to finance its budget and they achieved financial independence according to him.
I don't know if he is going to be allowed to run his country without debt, big bankers won't like if other countries start to follow El Salvador example.
https://x.com/nayibbukele/status/1835674214642106720
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